isawtmanGramcounter

82 points (view top contributors)
Madison // Wisconsin


 
Well, Jon, at least I back up my comments with real quotes. I'm still waiting for you to give us the link to the LBJ speech. Maybe you should do that instead of continuing to make nonsensical comments.
John, the Wilderness Act was the major legislation. Some flowery wording in a minor bill does not usurp the Wilderness Act And you forgot to mention the paragraph where the Rattlesnake National Recreation and Wilderness Act of 1980 says "the Rattlesnake Wilderness as designated by this Act shall be administered by the Secretary of Agriculture,…
Jon, the original intent of the Wilderness Act is clear. What part of "no other form of mechanical transport" don't you understand.
So far, Jo, you have not provide 1 iota of information to support your views. You should have stopped when you were ahead.
So John, if you want to take strictly, perhaps you should be lobbying for the removal of "cross country skis, boats with mechanical oarlocks, snowshoes with mechanically pivoting bindings, etc" from Wilderness Areas instead of lobbying for having Mountain bikes in Wilderness Areas. The fact is that the reason that those items are including in…
The only reason STC may be against ebikes is that it puts bicycles in the class of Motorized Vehicles and the Wilderness Act specifically bans motorized vehicles. It also bans non-motorized vehicles to with the phrase "no other form of mechanical transport," but, it an error of strategy, STC claims that "mechanical transport" means the…
Jon, Send us the link to the speech. The Wilderness Act was passed in 1964, so it's obvious that he was trying to promote something else. You need to get your head out of your tail.
LOL, LBJ's Forgotten Outdoorsman speech was for the National Trails Act, not the Wilderness Act. I rest my case.
Jon Wrote: "The fact is unchanged that bicycles were included in the original act as the signing president stated." Okay, then LET'S SEE THE STATEMENT from the "signing President." I provided a quote from the actual Wilderness Act that backs up my point of view. Perhaps you need to back up some of your stuff.…
Jon, why don't I just quote the Wilderness Act so YOU and everyone else can read it, because apparently you have not read it. Here is the line in question: "there shall be no temporary road, no use of motor vehicles, motorized equipment or motorboats, no landing of aircraft, no other form of mechanical transport,…
vapidoscar, yes, I have an alert that let's me know when an article appears about mountain biking in Wilderness Areas. An Alert is fairly easy to set up using google. Just google "google, setting up an alert." And Yes, STC is on the wrong end of history here. First of all, the only person they…
The Wilderness Act clearly says "no other form of mechanical transport" so it's obvious that mountain bikes were never meant to be in Wilderness Areas. I'm afraid the Sustainable Trails Coalition is on the wrong end of history on this one. The great ironic thing about this is that Ted Stroll is over 60 and…
Jeff, my point was there is much trail to ride on north of the Wilderness. The Trail really isn't cut in two because there isn't that much trail south of the wilderness. There is only something like 20 miles that mountain bikers can ride south of the Wilderness. So, Mountain bikers have the majority of…
yes, Jeff you can call me whatever names you would like. You're just making my case for me. If you cannot be civilized here in the comment section, well, meeting you out on the trail isn't going to be all that pleasant either. You're making a great case for separate trails for separate uses.
When you start making personal attacks on me, that only means I've won the debate. Plus, you have no idea where I will be hiking in the future.
And hopefully the PCT can go through more Wilderness Areas in the Future.
Jeff, this article is about Wilderness Areas and I have been in plenty of Wilderness Areas including doing some trail work
But you still had more than 80 miles of Centennial Trail north of the Wilderness that you could ride on.
Jeff, I hate to break it to you but the phrase “no mechanical transport or delivery of persons or supplies” still bans mountain bikes. As you know, at the Wilderness Act Hearings in 1964, Congressman Compton White Jr asked the following question to Forest Service Lawyer Mr Florance. "I'm talking about the mechanical contraption behind…
First of all, John, I am honored that you joined singletracks just to chat with me. I'm sure the folks at singletracks are thrilled, too. I have never heard of a horse crashing into a bear on a trail. The problem with mountain bikers is they consider horseback riders the evil ones. The problem with…
But Jeff, Ted Stroll does have some far fetched ideas. My personal favorite is when Ted wrote that if Fishing Reels are allowed in Wilderness Areas, then so should mountain bikes be allowed. The reason is that fishing reels provide the mechanical transport of fishing line out into the water. Folks I am not making…
Jeff, debunking your BS doesn't take very much time. I still have time to go hiking and do trail building and maintenance. Which, by the way, your organization, STC has never sponsored a trail building or maintenance event.
Jeff, Thanks for calling me names. It's at that point I know I have won the debate.
1. John wrote "In the hearing Congressman did ask about other forms of Transportation other than motorized transportation." Thanks for proving MY POINT. It shows that Congress was concerned about more than just motorized transport. The fact that they wrote "no other form" also shows that they were concerned about more than just motorized transport.…
I'm afraid a handful of responses to a flawed poll on a mountain biking website doesn't reflect the views of most people.
John Fisch is totally wrong again. 1. In the hearing Congressman did ask about other forms of Transportation other than motorized transportation. John Fisch knows this is an absolute fact. The most famous case of that is when Compton White Jr ask said "What about the mechanical device behind the horse?" 2. Mountain biking wasn't…
okay, if I am SO IGNORANT riddle me this When was the last time a hiker was hiking down a trail and CRASHED INTO A BEAR??? THAT WOULD BE NEVER Crashing into a bear is totally different that having a bear charge you, etc. Brad Treat was going at a high rate of speed and…
Frank, you totally missed the point, and you are completely wrong with your statement: "I don’t for one second think they had a bicycle in mind when that was written. It was simply an over broad term for automobiles and engine based transportation being applied to bicyclist." It's obvious you have never read the Wilderness…
The Wilderness Act clearly says "no other form of Mechanical Transport" that's why bikes are not allowed and horses are allowed. Frank says that some horses "seem to be VERY poorly trained at this point making them dangerous to all parties on the trail." That's why we need Wilderness so horseriders can have a place…
Canada also has some areas that are more restrictive than our Wilderness Areas. I'd like to see that, too.
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