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Read the tips in the hill climb training thread in this forum. Some of those folks gave some great advice.

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"treky92" wrote

Has anyone done anything like this or have any tips for fast recovery for the muscles?

I’ve never done anything like this, so I probably shouldn’t be giving advice. But since no one else is giving it … If you can have someone meet you at your campsites, make sure that person brings eggs for muscle recovery and some form of starchy food—potatoes, bananas, peas, beans (black and pinto), etc.—for energy. Chocolate and cheese are both great high-energy foods and should be included as well. Eat the cheese after/during the ride and the chocolate before/during, and lean toward dark chocolate rather than Snickers bars.

The thing is, you can replenish glycogen stores to some degree, but it’s going to be difficult to repair muscle damage with back-to-back riding. Try to keep the intensity down early on so things don’t get too catabolic. Have beef jerky with you and munch on it throughout your rides—keeping your protein needs satisfied should make a big difference.

And give yourself plenty of time to wind down before you turn in for the night so you get a good night’s rest. That’s all I’ve got. Best of luck! Make sure to share a ride report somewhere so we can see it, eh?

Edit: If you don’t want to bring a bunch of melted chocolate bars with you, GU makes a dark chocolate energy gel with thick Belgian chocolate in it. I’m a little more partial to the mint chocolate version, but that’s my preference.

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"lsuche1996" wrote

I hate to have to take "off days" to just sit and wait for healing to kick in. What can I do to expedite the process?

If you don’t want to take a zero on your training calendar, trying lap swimming. Seriously.

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Completely agree with all of your points. I don’t own a singlespeed and I don’t intend to build one up, but otherwise, you’ve described my proposed training program for this next year pretty well.

Congrats on your progress—sounds like you developed some pretty strong climbing legs.

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"Jared13" wrote

Anyone have else one? Real or "unofficial" like mine is fine. 😃

I’ll be hitting the weights this winter. I keep losing weight unwittingly, so the plan is to make that stop. Besides that, snowshoeing, jogging, maybe the occasional spin class. We’ll see.

I like your basement bike ride idea. My daughter just dropped the training wheels this year, and I’m thinking she’d get a kick out of that too.

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I’ll admit: I use an HRM, but only on road rides. I think they’re pretty worthless on the trail.

I don’t know which one is the best. Mine is just a simple strap with an HRM watch. I’ve never tried anything else. Mine was a gift, but I believe the person found it online for less than $50.

Hope you find what you’re looking for.

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Have you tried picking up your front wheel as you hit the obstacle? This is what you did all those upright rows in the off-season for, right? Ha ha.

No, seriously, try picking up your front wheel just as you meet the obstacle. Once your front wheel is on top of it, a quick lunge with your hips should get your rear wheel up and over.

Good luck. Sounds like a blast of a trail!

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"brianW" wrote

just a thought, how about a stationary/trainer set at the hardest settings. You could do an hour or two while watching the tv at night. Not as fun as riding but i am sure it will help out some.

Actually, that’s a great thought. One of the toughest hillclimbers I know (did the recent road bike race with a 23 as his easiest gear—over gradients of 10-18%!) does most of his riding, intervals and all, on the trainer indoors. He’s also does quite a bit of weightlifting: http://www.gymjones.com/disciples.php?id=27

Of course, you’d have to prop the front wheel up a little higher to accurately mimic climbing.

I’m of the school of thought that says you need to increase muscle-fiber recruitment for this sort of effort to improve at it (without increasing them so much that you become a track cycling sprinter).

Of course, varied-intensity training is crucial too, and the trainer (if you can stand the thing) is a great place for keeping a constant aerobic effort.

Yeah, great thoughts. It’s funny that we opened this thread years ago, and I’m still doing hillclimbs and trying to figure the hillclimb puzzle out.

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"ghevener" wrote

The best way to become better at hill climbing is to simply get out there and climb the hills. Overall strength is essential, but at the end of the day, you will get the most bang for your buck from simply climbing hills. The mentality that comes with being able to climb long hills is something that you must learn to endure and eventually come to embrace and enjoy climbing.

Thanks, Ghevener.

I just won the cat V division of a 3,200-foot, six-mile road hillclimb last week, so this subject is fresh on my mind. Unfortunately, they canceled the 4,000-foot, seven-mile mtb hillclimb I was hoping to target this year. I’ll probably go ride it for fun anyway—once the snow clears off the summit in August.

Are you anywhere near Idaho? You could always come ride it with me.

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"stymie2000" wrote

So, am I doing something wrong or does it seem like my watts reading is just off?

I wouldn’t worry too much about it unless you’ve had some real-world experience to back it up. Data sources are only so useful. Whether your power meter is reading correctly is truly impossible for someone to say from across the interwebs (looks fine from here 😆). Just jump in a race, give it a shot and see what comes out. Besides, suppose for a second that it’s reading correctly—what are you going to do that you’re not already doing?

One other thought: weighing in at 145 means you’ll require less power to go fast than someone who weighs, I dunno, 200 pounds or something. Us little guys tend not to crank out as much power as the big guys (face the facts, we have smaller muscles), and it really isn’t that big a deal. What matters is how fast you and your bicycle go.

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I took up snowshoeing this winter, and I LOVE IT!!!

But yeah, weights and stationary trainer—those too.

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"CraigCreekRider" wrote

We have one in my area that always intriques me, but I am afraid I would just embarrass myself. Yea, I’m kind of slow. The course is 6 3/4 miles of mostly dirt road with 3000 feet of vertical, and the steepest part is at the top. I think I would like to try the climb without the race sometime.
http://www.roanokecountyva.gov/Departme … lClimb.htm

These types of races remind me of the XXC races, just finishing is a major feat; you against the mountain or course (of course winning would be OK too 😆 )

I think you should do it. I really think this kind of race is fun … and brutal. No, seriously, go do it. The hillclimb is a dying race format. You never know how many more opportunities you’ll have to do them.

Seriously, there was a race that I talked about doing for two or three years. It looked SO COOL. But I never worked up the guts to do it. Then, out of nowhere, the entire series got canceled. Now, the race doesn’t even exist, and I don’t have the option of racing it.

So just go do it. If you hate it, you don’t ever have to do it again. Heck, you don’t even have to finish.

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"Goo" wrote

Wow, a straight hill climb race sounds like some sort of nightmare to me. I’d say the number one thing for extended climbs is staying seated to conserve energy. After that, incredible focus, and an ability to force yourself to endure great pain just to prove yourself better than someone else (and maybe win some prizes).

You know, call this weird, but I’ve decided I really enjoy climbing and hillclimb races. They’re, well … sorta fun, honestly. And truth be known, I usually have much better results at normal XC races than I do at hillclimbs (thanks to there being more divisions and therefore more hardware at XC races), but I still really like doing hillclimbs. I keep telling people it’s all about the scenery.

By the way, if you guys want to see photos or read the full race report from those two hillclimbs, you can find ’em on my blog:
Here:
http://uphillbattle.spaces.live.com/blo … 3870.entry

And here:
http://uphillbattle.spaces.live.com/blo … 3862.entry

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"Suvacrew" wrote

I’d add…don’t be adverse to doing some targeted weight training with the cross training. We can all have strong legs and lungs, but if your core is weak and your psoas fatigues…it’s all for naught.

Yeah, see, I absolutely agree with this. I think overall body strength is pretty underrated in mountain biking. It’s CRUCIAL.

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Great tips, all. Let’s keep the discussion going. Let me share my experience and my thoughts about it:

I did two mtb hillclimbs this year. I got slaughtered on one and did okay on the other.

The first one (where I got slaughtered) was 7.2 miles and 4,139 feet for elevation gain. It was mid-August, the sun was brutal and the trail, er, fire road was loose and dusty. I got about four hours of sleep the night before (kids), so I decided to just do the race for fun. I showed up wearing sandals and baggy shorts. My bike set up was goofy with platform pedals, my heavy alu handlebar, bar-ends and semi-commuter tires (Bontrager Connections – not the mountain connections either). I also had my seat farther forward than it needed to be and the easiest gear I had on my cassette was a lousy 30-tooth sprocket. Oh yeah, and I had no suspension—zero.

Well, the course was steeper than I ever imagined, and the result of the above setup was that I had no traction on the loose parts of the trail at all. My tires weren’t gripping, I didn’t have enough weight over the rear wheel, and I wasn’t carrying through the entire pedal stroke without my clipless pedals and shoes. I thought I’d use the bar-ends WAY more than I did, but with a course that steep, I really didn’t need them at all. I walked a significant amount of the course, and when I was riding, my head was bobbing close enough for me to kiss my stem.

About a month later, I found a similar race at a ski resort in Utah near where I have some relatives. It was 5 miles and give or take 3,100 feet of elevation gain. I stripped all the weight off my bike that I could. I put my carbon handlebar back on, swapped the heavy seat out for a 190-gram seat, left the bar-ends off, put the clipless pedals back on, etc. I still had the commuter tires, but I left the forkshock off and got my bike down to about 24 pounds (not bad for a late-’90s alu hardtail).

For training, I’d been riding the steepest trail I could (probably 800 feet over 1 mile—seriously) and practicing redlining over the really steep parts of the trail, rolling my granny gear much of the time—even before I knew about that race. I’d also picked weightlifting back up and was doing a few sets of power cleans each week. Nothing too extreme.

This time, I did pretty well. In fact, I think I might’ve been able to stay on the wheels of the front group if it weren’t for one little snag: There was a trail running race going at the same time, and some of the runners decided to clog the trail, thereby forcing me to hike until we got to a point where I could remount and pass them. In the end, I came in third for my age group with a good but not stellar time. There’s still room for improvement—lots in fact.

On that note, here’s my plan for improving next time:

• BETTER TIRES. The Bontrager Connections are great for moist trails, but not for the dry, loose stuff. I’m still looking for a light tire (I don’t need a big, jagged 2.2 or anything), but it needs to be knobbier and grippier. Lots of options

• A 32-tooth gear (which I’ve already purchased). I was only passed by one rider late in the second race, and I noticed he was spinning his cranks faster when we were side-by-side (which we were for a minute or more). He obviously had an easier gear to turn than I did.

• Strength conditioning. LT/AT training is good, methinks. But by the last mile in both races, my heart rate was surely way lower than my threshold because my legs were totally blown from a muscular fatigue standpoint. I figure I need to do a little more overdistance, overgearing (on road climbs) and do the LT/AT work after that. Then, to finish it off, I need to spend some more time on that ultra-steep fireroad working on the steep gradients. That’s me, anyway. Maybe your needs would be different.

• Move my saddle back. I did this a little before the second race, but I think I could’ve done it more than I did. It’s pretty important to have your weight over the back wheel on these climbs, particularly if the trail is loose.

One thought about training: I’m a scrawny guy—about 135 pounds. And the race winner at my second race was about my size, albeit an inch or so taller. But the 2nd and 3rd place guys were much bigger than both of us and had obviously spent some time in the weight room. That taught me right there that you don’t have to be small to be a good climber. I sorta wonder if weight loss is overrated when it comes to cycling. It seems like increasing muscle mass is more important.

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Okay, another year has gone by, and we’ve all learned a little more about climbing and mountain bike fitness. So let me repeat the question:

What have you guys learned that would benefit someone preparing for a hillclimb race? How would you prepare for a sustained climb of more than 45 minutes?

P.S. In case anyone’s curious, I did manage to come away from a mountain bike hillclimb race with hardware this past year, and I did learn a few things from that experience. I’ll post my advice if you post yours. C’mon, let’s liven the training forum up a little!!!

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"Jayers" wrote

I am about to ride in my first race as a Beginner. I recently read a blog by an Expert or Elite racer that he took all the big hills on foot. Is this something I need to think about? I know the course has this one big hill at the beginning that if I ride it my heart will be hammering and it will take me five minutes to recover.

Just wondering what you racers think are strategies for riding hills.

John

What distances does this blogger race typically? That just doesn’t seem like the ideal strategy for a cross-country race in my opinion, unless there are going to be some REALLY brutal hills later or a really long race distance ahead (the aforementioned Leadville 100 qualifies on both counts).

Typically, a cross-country race takes place over 15-25 miles worth of terrain, some of which will be fire road and some of which will be singletrack. They also typically end where they started, which should tell you that you’ll descend just as much height as you’ll ascend.

While this isn’t true for all cases, the XC races I’ve done typically have one big, brutal climb that lasts 20 minutes at most, usually more like 10. Then you descend (allowing for a little recovery). Then, you climb again and repeat. I don’t know your racecourse specifically, but here’s my prediction: If you DON’T hammer that climb, you’ll be WAY off the back. Unless you’re a monster on the downhills (or have 5 inches of travel front and rear), it’ll be extremely difficult to make up that ground on the downhill, particularly if the descent is on singletrack.

On the other hand, you know your limits and you know your racecourse. Be smart and race your strengths.

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I vote for jersey only.

I’m just a little picky about how my lycra shorts fit, y’know?

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"DaleCannon" wrote

Ok thanks! I appreciate all that info alot! But I have a question about the weights, weight training with the legs does build power, but I heard it also decreases endurance. I just heard that, its not set in stone but can you clarify what kind of lifting I should be doing?

Bear in mind that you’re getting this information from an amateur racer who can barely afford three or four hours of actual bike riding per week. I can weightlift any evening, however, because it takes so little time.

Honestly, I think the advice to avoid weightlifting is bunk, particularly for short races that involve variable pacing (i.e. short track or even cross country). Ned Overend advocates weightlifting (here: http://www.boure.com/wintertraining.html ) and he’s not the only pro to do so. I have it on semi-good authority (found it: http://74.125.153.132/search?q=cache:_c … ent=safari ) that Elizabeth Osl used weightlifting as part of her recipe for conquering the World Cup XCO series this year.

Now, granted, if you read the official science literature about endurance cycling, they’ll tell you weightlifting gives no advantage, but this is one place where my experience and the available scientific info differ. (Besides, you’re slamming the trails for 25 minutes, not racing RAAM.) You can experiment with this yourself and see if it works or doesn’t work for you. You may find that weightlifting is a detriment to your training (as regional pro/cyclocrosser Kathy Sherwin did. Read here: http://www.mtbracenews.com/2008/10/hey- … -your.html )

But given the explosive nature of mountain bike racing, I think you’ll find weightlifting a helpful aspect of training.

(The long explanation is that you have three energy systems in your body: aerobic, anaerobic and creatine phosphate. Good endurance athletes emphasize aerobic but don’t neglect anaerobic or creatine phosphate—even marathon runners. Weightlifting builds creatine phosphate while anaerobic and aerobic should be done on the bike.)

Something to bear in mind: Avoid training for hypertrophy during the season. Consider it maintenance lifting or even switch it with plyometrics. Do fewer SETS on fewer days per week (two at most); do higher reps and use less weight.

What lifts should you do? That’s up to you. Personally, I’m a fan of leg press (although I no longer have one available to me), squats, dead lift, power cleans … that’s about it for my legs. I like chin-ups, push ups and core work for the upper half.

I should also mention that I don’t gain muscle easily, so I don’t worry about getting bulky. Whether that’s true for you will determine how and how much you should lift. That’s largely a function of the ratio of type 1 and type 2 muscle fiber you were genetically endowed with, although muscle fiber expression is obviously trainable.

Also, don’t neglect strength training ON THE BIKE.

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"DaleCannon" wrote

Since short track is pretty much redlining it for at least 25 min I was wondering if there were any types of workouts like intervals and such.

I have to admit that I’ve never raced short track, but I’ve done some cross country races, etc., so I can tell you what I [i:2g0ksh8b]think[/i:2g0ksh8b] you should do training-wise.

You’re dead on about the intervals, I think. Specifically, hit the shorter intervals (4, 6, and 10 minute) and try to gradually lower your recovery in between intervals. Start with 2x10x3 (two ten-minute intervals with a three-minute recovery in between). Try to reduce the recovery to two minutes. Then move on to six-minute intervals, 3or4x6x2. Then on to the fours.

But because it’s mountain bike, I wouldn’t leave out doing 30s sprint intervals as well. Go hard for 30 seconds, recover for 30 seconds, repeat. If you get bored doing this in the middle of nowhere, go find a road with four or five traffic lights in a mile or a half mile and then practice racing the cars from light to light. One warning about that: Don’t get killed.

I’d bet cyclocross would make for good cross (no pun intended) training. Just race your mt bike. Also, don’t neglect weightlifting. Hitting the weights can help you build up speed for those short, hard climbs.

One other thought: With a race as short as 25 minutes, you’ll still need to build something of a base. Spend some time getting aerobic in the spring before you hit the intervals hard.

Best of luck!

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