September 21, 2019 at 4:46 pm #270610
I am looking to upgrade to a full suspension bike from my Trek Stache 7. Evil had their frames on sale and I was considering one, but I’m concerned about the size of the frame. I love the fit of my Stache, but I’ve ridden a 2018 Trek Fuel 8 and it felt too small.
I’m thinking the reach+stem length is what I should be looking at, because the Stache is 517mm and the Fuel EX 8 was only 510mm.
Looking at those numbers, the Evil The Calling MB frame would be 452mm + Stem (which Evil recommends 30-50mm), which is much shorter than what I prefer.
Does anyone have any experience on how the Calling MB frame feels compared to other bikes? I would ride a large frame. I’m also trying to find an Evil to demo, but there aren’t any dealers near me.
September 23, 2019 at 4:04 am #270630
It might help to know how tall you are. I am 5’9″ and a medium fits me fine with a 30mm stem. Also knowing the basic area where you are might help someone find a dealer close enough to work with on getting a demo ride. And actually the Following reach is 452, the Calling is 457. And they say, I have not tried one, the Following, with the shorter reach, feels bigger.
September 23, 2019 at 9:56 am #270635
I think a better way to get the fit right is to add effective toptube length plus stem length. For any given bike that fits you, that sum should be about the same. If you have a long toptube plus a short stem or a short toptube plus a long stem they should add up to be about the same. If you can get the toptube length for your Stache from the Trek website and add that to your stem length, you can use that to compare with other bikes.
When I bought my last bike, the size medium fit with the stock 60mm stem plus 610mm toptube which equals 670mm but I bought the size large with a 640mm toptube and put on a 35mm stem which equals 675mm and then adjusted the seat foward. I prefer short stems and more progressive geometry. Progessive geometry bikes are designed for short stems, 30-50mm, and once you get used to it, you won’t want to go back to riding long stems. I wouldn’t buy any new bike that required a stem longer than 50mm. The great thing about short stem bikes is that it makes it very difficult to go over the handlebars. Say good bye to the Endo. Evil recommends a 30-50mm stem and I wouldn’t pick a size that required the use of a longer stem. Trust me. After just a few rides, you won’t notice how short the stem is but you will notice how stable and planted the bike is on the descents.
September 23, 2019 at 12:38 pm #270636
Evil’s sizing are a bit different than most brands in that most riders typically size “down”, myself included. I’m 6’2″ with a neutral ape index (i.e. arm span comparable to height). I demo’ed a Following (size L) which was the right size for me. I have since purchased the Offering (also size L) which is spot on. But for most other brands I would be looking at an XL. My recommendation would be to contact Evil directly as they are very responsive. In addition, there are a bunch of threads at MTBR that provide additional insight.
September 23, 2019 at 7:53 pm #270673
Thanks for your feedback!
Alvin, I am 6′ with a 32″ inseam. I am in Northeast Ohio, so it looks like the closest dealer to me is in Cincinniti (~6hrs).
Plusbike Nerd, looking at the top tube+ stem makes my current bike look HUGE compared to all the bikes I am looking at (620+90=710mm; Evil The Calling 624+40=662mm). I can’t image that my Stache hardtail from 2013 was that ahead of it’s time geometry wise to be longer/slacker than most current trail bikes, but I cannot seem to understand the geometry measurements that compare to what I am feeling on the bike.
I am nervous because I had a Trek 4300 before my Stache that I was not comfortable on at all because the bike felt much too short despite being the correct size for me. Maybe the updated geometry of seat/head tube angles and shorter stems play a bigger part in the feel than the standard geometry dimensions the manufacturer’s provide.
September 24, 2019 at 1:23 pm #270701
I have 2 bikes. One is a full-sus 2009 XC bike (old school geometry, short toptube, 90mm long stem). The other is a full-sus 2018 Trail bike(modern progressive geometry, long toptube, 35mm short stem). When I measure from the back of the saddle to the center of the handlebar both bikes measure within 0.5 inches (12mm) of each other and both feel right for me.
Measure your current bike from the back of the saddle to the center of the handle bars. Then go to you local bike shop with your tape measure and test ride some new progessive geometry bikes that have that same measurement. I think you’re going to find that those bikes with the same measurement will fit you well regardless of geometry. Then look to see what size the bike is.
I’m 5’8″ tall and my toptube plus stem measurement is about 675mm. You’re 6″ tall. That your toptube plus stem measurement would be 35mm longer than mine doesn’t suprise me in the least.
Bike size charts are just guidelines. There is big part that is personal preference. Some people have long torsos and some people have short torsos. Some people like the feel of a longer bike and some people like the feel of a shorter bike. If you have a long torso and like the feel of a longer bike you bike could be happiest with 1 or 2 sizes longer than the recommended bike. It’s all about what you like not what a bike manufacturer suggests for some theoretical average person. For myself, I’ve always prefered at least 1 size larger that the recommend bike.
To get the best out of modern progressive geometry bikes, I believe it is better to get a bike that is too big and then shorten the stem and push the seat forward if necessary than to get a bike that is too small and then lengthen the stem and push the seat back. Pushing the seat back and using a long stem negates everything a progressive geo bike is trying to accomplish— improving descending ability while maintaining climbing ability.
September 23, 2019 at 8:53 pm #270677
I would think a Large would be right for you. But St. Catharines Ontario, Inception Cyclery should only be about 2.5 hours from your area. Not sure about importing, but for a demo ride it might be worth it. And MooseJaw in Briminham MI should be about 4 hours.
September 25, 2019 at 8:55 am #270713
@MikeyFlo86: “Plusbike Nerd, looking at the top tube+ stem makes my current bike look HUGE compared to all the bikes I am looking at (620+90=710mm; Evil The Calling 624+40=662mm). I can’t image that my Stache hardtail from 2013 was that ahead of it’s time geometry wise to be longer/slacker than most current trail bikes, but I cannot seem to understand the geometry measurements that compare to what I am feeling on the bike.”
The Stache isn’t bigger at all, but you are using a much longer stem. 50mm is a huge difference when it comes to body position and handling. Shit, I haven’t used a 90mm stem on anything road bikes included for more than a dozen years. It’s a damn reverse tiller that puts you way too far out over the front giving plenty of opportunity to go over the bars. A longer top tube with a shorter stem provides both a more balanced and safe ride.
As for your height and The Calling, get a large. The XL is really too much for the bike it is and really doesn’t work well for any climbing. Our owner at 6’3″ had an XL and hated it as he was too far over the back of the bike for a solid pedaling position. BTW, the biggest stem he runs is a 50mm.
Lastly, I’d recommend you consider a 29er. Yes, they simply fit taller people better. The Calling is the bike to get if you want to thrash everything and be a complete hooligan on even the most tame trails. Evil’s 29ers will do this too, but also let you haul ass up, over, and off of everything as well.
September 25, 2019 at 12:18 pm #270718
Dr Sweets, Your comment about the stem being the factor that is giving me the length I want is what has me concerned. I am very comfortable on my current bike and it looks like even with the longer/slacker trend, that I need to size up to get a similar feeling without using a longer than recommended stem on most new bikes.
I am afraid that going to a large frame will have me feeling much too far forward on the bike, unless I shouldn’t consider the stem length when looking at frame sizing. If that’s the case, then everything makes sense again! haha
Also, I am looking at Evil bikes because of the 40% off sale they have on frames, and The Following is unfortunately sold out already.
September 25, 2019 at 3:09 pm #270732
@MikeyFlo86: “Dr Sweets, Your comment about the stem being the factor that is giving me the length I want is what has me concerned. I am very comfortable on my current bike and it looks like even with the longer/slacker trend, that I need to size up to get a similar feeling without using a longer than recommended stem on most new bikes.
Also, I am looking at Evil bikes because of the 40% off sale they have on frames, and The Following is unfortunately sold out already.”
Please be aware of the fact that your Stache and The Calling were designed with very different handling/riding goals. Every modern bike over the last few years puts the rider more upright and centered on the bike. If you are dead set on the length you are at, then yeah, you should size up and go with a very short stem to taste. That said, don’t consider stem length when looking frames as that is variable that can be changed whereas the frame size mostly cannot. IMHO, I would still recommend you go with a large. You will be more upright and way more comfortable. Lastly, tbh I think you will find The Calling to be exponentially more capable than the Stache.
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